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March 02, 2010

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joe schmo

youre a fucking idiot

pnic

wow. you clearly have no idea what you are talking about. the video & song were meant to be a joke. it's called parody. students talk about this place because we go here & we have the right to make fun of it. it's like the same way people talk about the place they live even though they like it. you don't have a clue. and yeah some people go here because it's a "party school" but it's a misconception. there are just as many parties here as any other wet campus. If you plan out your schedule right and work for what you want, you will work your ass off. not every class is as easy as the lyrics in the video. like you said, these students are only freshman. check back in when they reach 300 & 400 level classes. please get the right information before you start making accusations.

ashley

you have no idea what you're talking about. good luck trying to turn people against keene, it's not gonna happen. keene is more than just a party school, get your facts straight.

joe schmo

way to delete my comment, ill say it again. your blog sucks

fairandbalanced

We are all entitled to our own opinions, and as much as I respect the work that you do, I don't exactly agree with everything you say. First, it's obvious that this is a parody and nearly every college in the US can relate. Even on supposed "dry" campuses, kids will find ways and places to party. I also don't agree with your condescending tone. If you're trying to impart wisdom and educate people, don't disrespect these two freshmen. Just because they made a video and song about college party life at Keene State doesn't mean they're the only two people on campus who party, and this video won't attract a considerable amount of applicants. The words "partying" and "college" have gone hand in hand ever since the movie Animal House came out. And I know some extremely talented individuals who have graduated from Keene, and who knows, they may have lived part of the party life portrayed in this video and song. And lastly, you talk about libel. If Lauren and Dylan's words are malicious, couldn't one say that some of your words about them are libelous, too?

Craig Brandon

Dear fairandbalanced,

Thanks for taking the time to comment on my blog. I agree that the song is a parody, or perhaps more accurately a satire. But there has to be some truth behind it for it to work. And I'm sorry if my tone was a bit off. I actually think the two students who made the video and talented and creative. I also know many talented KSC alumni, but unfortunately they are a small minority. It's hard to tell in the video who are real people and who are actors, but they need to be careful making fun of real people.

An Update: My book has been edited and fact checked and dozens of people have read it. While it's a tough sell convincing people that kids can ruin their lives by going to college, readers think I made the case. The publishers are out looking for endorsements right now and the book should be out in early August. I'm sure in six months I will be the most hated person in higher education, but, hey, the truth hurts. My plan is to help set up some kind of foundation designed to stamp out party schools.

Jeff

I think you are the one who needs an education on libel. You have taken a satirical video and spun it to portray Keene as something it most certainly is not - as you say, an "anti-intellectual adolescent resort". Sure, there are freshmen at Keene who don't put forth the required effort - but that doesn't make Keene State different from any other school in America, and that isn't the fault of the college.

I graduated from Keene in 2007. My experience was beyond expectations of a state college, both while I matriculated and in starting what I'd consider to be a solid career since I left. It's easy to find examples of students who have graduated and had a hard time, particularly when you look in an area that doesn't have an abundance of industry. Most of the friends I graduated with moved away from the Keene area, but are holding solid jobs and doing just fine.

The real crime in higher education is that people are led to believe that spending tens of thousands of dollars more on a degree from a private institution will give them a leg up. Nobody covers the reality - that in the job market, employers see two categories - ivy league graduates and everyone else. You are only helping to perpetuate this mistruth and discouraging people from getting a quality education that's far more affordable than many others.

Craig Brandon

Jeff...

Thanks for your comments and they have reminded me that I have not said in a while that I firmly believe that 10 percent of students at party schools really are dedicated students who want to learn. The statistics back that up and teachers from around the country told me that they consistently have two or three real students in each class. So perhaps you and your friends were members of this elite group?

The same statistics show that 45 percent of students are "totally disengaged" and make up the group of anti-intellectual students who actually resist learning and are only in school for the party. Certainly during your time you must have run into many of these kinds of students, right?

In my experience this larger group intimidates the elite group, both actively and passively to the point that the elite students refused to ask questions in class and saved them for my office hours. So my teaching was divided between actual classes in which students made rude and inapporpriate comments, ate their lunches and texted on their cell phones and the actual learning, which took place at my office hours.

I think if you take a moment to recall your college years you will know exactly that I am talking about.

Mallory Botar

WOW Craig- This is Mallory!!! After you came into my place of work and acted like I was a lower class citizen because I had a second job, you are going to represent me like this!! I was a business manager for a local manufacturing company. Yeah so I only made $18/hour but I didn't work at Friendly's just to pay my $30,000 in student loans. I worked there to save up extra money so that I could move out of New Hampshire. I do have $30,000 in student loans. Not Keene State's fault. That is the fault of the loan companies that trick you into thinking at 17-18 you are getting free money and they lend you way more than you need.
I didn't choose Keene State because it was a party school. I was 17 and going to be a sophomore. I wanted to be close to my family. Considering I was from Keene, it was the most comfortable choice for me to make. I did not "party" at Keene State. My friends were all from Keene, and I only went to Keene State parties maybe 3 times in 3 years.
You really have some nerve. I'm sorry that now I have decided to pursue American Sign Language and you wonder why I didn't do that first... I GRADUATED HIGH SCHOOL AT 16 YEARS OLD I DID NOT KNOW WHAT I WANTED TO DO WITH MY LIFE AT 16!!! I GRADUATED FROM KSC with a 3.9 GPA, Honors, and the Honors Capstone for Management at 20! Really at 20 I didn't know what I wanted to do, that is why I chose Management so that I had options.
You really make me sick! I didn't like you when I was on the Equinox because you always tried to push your own agenda. Now you use my personal life to do the same. You know nothing about me! You just came into Friendly's ate your burger and treated me like a lower class citizen and told me that my degree meant nothing. I am sorry that I work hard so that I can get out of debt. I have a car, a truck, a 4wheeler, 2 dogs, a house... of course I work hard.
Get over yourself and leave me out of your blogs!!! Keene State isn't the problem. Keene is just a dead end town with no opportunity. If you keep getting answers from the people who stay there then you are going to keep getting the distorted information that is perfect for your agenda.

Thanks Craig!!

Mallory Bitar
Keene State '07
Magna Cum Laude - Delta Mu Delta
Previous Business Manager of the Equinox
Not a fan of Craig Brandon as of now.

Craig Brandon

Dear Mallory,

Thank you for taking the time to comment.
First of all, I want to point out that it was not my purpose to violate your privacy. I purposely did not use your last name so I could protect your identity.

Second, thank you for acknowledging that you were a victim of the predatory lending industry, which does exactly what you say - convinces students to take out more money than they need because they make it seem like a free ride.

What you are missing in your analysis, however, is the close connection between these predators and colleges. Do you really think colleges don't know what is going on with these lenders and how they rip off students? Yet the predators are still on the colleges' "preferred lender" lists?

NY Attorney General Andrew Cuomo called this relationship between colleges and lenders "the unholy alliance" and his brief investigation found that colleges were accepting kickbacks from the lenders to be put on these "preferred lender" lists. He found that many financial aid managers had stock in the lending companies. At many colleges when you called the college financial aid office the call was put right through to the lending company's office, where they pretended to be from the college! Many financial aid directors at prestigeous colleges like Columbia and Texas were fired after this was exposed.

If the college really cared about you, don't you think they would WARN you about these predators rather than hand over the application forms for them? Wouldn't they try to ban lenders who rip off students? The money flows directly from the lenders into the college coffers. And what do they use the money for? The costs of education are not increasing faster than inflation. Faculty salaries are not going up. What is going up? What about all those buildings that have nothing to do with education? What about the number of college administrators, which have gone up 30 percent? What about the salaries of top administrators, which increase by double digit percentages? Who do you think pays for all that? Students like you taking out tens of thousands of dollars in loans.

I am glad you understand that you were a victim of the system. That's the first step, and new laws have been passed to protect future students from the predatory lenders, so this abuse is not likely to continue so blatantly. But students like you who signed these horrible promisary notes are likely to have their futures damaged for decades and it's important that you see that colleges are just as guilty as the lenders. It's the colleges who raised the prices in the first place making it necessary to take out all those loans. They worked hand in hand to fleece students.

Another part of your message states that you feel that you entered college without a good understanding of what you wanted to do with your life. That is another part of my book. Most students aren't ready to do this at age 18 and you certainly were not at age 16. Wouldn't it be better to delay this kind of decision until later? Wouldn't it be better for you, now that you feel called on a career path, to start out fresh without that mountain of debt for a diploma you don't intend to use?

I didn't mean to say that your degree meant nothing, but I think you understand that the degree for which you paid a very high price is actually in the wrong field! That is also part of the reforms I am suggesting in my book. Don't force students to make a choice when they really have no idea what they want to do. There are millions of Americans paying for degrees in oceanography or film studies decades after they set down a different path, for which they either had to go back to get a second degree, or left their original degree hanging on the wall, unused.

It seems to me you are a good example of all this, stuck paying off your huge debt when you want to pursue a different path. It's like carrying around a ball and chain.

I'd recommend you pick up a copy of "The Student Loan Scam" by Alan Michael Collinge, which describes in detail people who are in your situtation, struggling to pay off the price of a college degree that they are not using. It explains how we got into this situation and quotes a lot of people exactly like you.

And if you still think that colleges are not a part of the problem, I'd suggest you take a look at the 2005 PBS video called "Declining by Degrees," which does an excellent job of explaining what is going on as colleges have shifted their focus from "education" to "retention."

And, just to make it clear, I don't think you are a second class citizen. What I think is that you are a victim of a system that deliberately set out to ensnare you. You owe it to yourself to dig a little deeper if you want to understand how and why it happened and join the reformers who want to prevent it from happening in the future.

BB

Personally, I think a grown man eating at Friendly's is a far more tragic scenario then a recent college grad trying to work her way through a tough economy.

I picture Mr. Brandon as some sort of old curmudgeon, eating a uber- processed double-patty beef burger topped with bacon and cheese. Ketchup stains on his shirt, judging a bright-eyed 21 year old on her college major and subsequent career choice.

What really irks me is that he tries to invalidate Mallory's professional job to nothing more than a "secretary"- obviously judging this job as menial. The level of elitism and pretentiousness is unconscionable, especially since Mr. Brandon used to be professor at this "sub prime" school. What does that say about him?


Mallory Botar

Craig-
I agree with the last comment. I really wish you have something better to do with your life. I had a lot more going on when I was in school to make it more difficult for me to know what I want. My degree in management is very beneficial to me because as an Interpreter I will be working for myself and I have developed the skills I need to run my own business.
I believe that there were a lot of people that were hurt by the predatory lending, but to act like all Keene State is about is the parties and act like graduates can't do anything is just ignorant on your part. Both of my parents are KSC grads and they make more money then most people I know!
You obviously didn't protect my identity that well because another former student emailed me the link to your blog. You didn't even respect the things that I told you. You just heard what you wanted.
I am not going to waste any more of my time caring what you say, I just really hope that in the future you will take a lesson in libel and not misrepresent me like that...

Thank you

Megan

This blog is blasphemy. Keene State college has a wonderful education program, and that is why I chose to come here; not for the parties. There are parties at every college nationwide. I think you should do more research and realize that Keene State is a wonderful school with great faculty! Teachers here truly care about their students and will almost always make time for you. The classes are not easy as anything, you have to work for the grade you want, just like any other school. Keene is also not a dead-end town, it's beautiful and has lots of friendly locals around!
I think you using that poor girl, Mallory, as your misrepresented guinea pig is terrible of you. Have you nothing better to do than make up a stupid point that's .1% true and proceed to find someone to manipulate their words? I'm a double major, with a 3.6 GPA in two clubs working full time. You're a low-life Debbie Downer who sits on their blog making fun of the students aspiring to become something because you became nothing. Jealousy isn't pretty.

Craig Brandon

Megan,

Thank you for writing.

The statistics compiled by the National Survey of Student Engagement, which include survey responses from tens of thousands of American college students, including Keene State, show that only one student out of ten is "fully engaged" in the education program at colleges. That means they came to college to learn. They are curious about the world and make excellent students. It sounds to me like you are part of this group.

However, please take a look around at your fellow students. The same survey shows that 20 to 40 percent of students are "totally disengaged" from the education program. These are the slackers who spend six years partying, disrupting classes and not completing their assignments. You know those students in your classes who are talking, texting and listening to their Ipods. That is who I am talking about.

These students, who are a large minority at nearly every college, but tend to be attracted to low cost state universities, are wasting their time, wasting education resources, wasting taxpayer money, wasting their own money and, perhaps worst of all, destroying the college atmosphere by interrupting the learning process for students who really do want to learn.

Every professor I have spoken with agrees that they are there, but administrators pretend not to notice them. Why? Because they need their tuition money to keep the college operating. And what do administrators do with all that money? Again, look around. Do you notice all that yellow construction tape and hard hats? That is millions of dollars of your money being spent on buildings that have little to do with education. The number of administrators have increased by 30 percent in 10 years and adminitrator salaries have been increasing at a level much higher that the salaries of professors.

One professor found that only 21 percent of tuition money is spent on anything remotely connected with instruction. The president of Keene State, in fact, receives compensation of over a quarter of a million dollars a year, including a free house and a car, and nearly all of that money comes out of tuition. In other words, YOU are paying for it.

Think how much better your college experience would be if colleges only accepted students like you and sent away all the slackers who are wasting their time and money.

That is what my book is about. My goal is not to bash colleges but to encourage them to improve. They need to toss out the slackers and binge drinkers and and stop paying their administrators like Wall Street executives. They need to focus on the students who really want to learn. Like you.

Wouldn't you like to know

Ok Craig, some people that go this college are a complete joke and waste their money. But this video is not meant to be taken that seriously. In fact, there are a lot of bright and good students here who are really motivated and have great futures ahead of them. Keene State is actually a great place for education, and those who only want to spend their money on drinking and don't go to class are the ones who don't make it through this college.(40%) Simple as that. It's pretty obvious that if the video is meant to be funny and entertaining. If the video was all about how good students are and how long they study, I don't think anyone would have watched it. Whoever Mallory is, maybe she is better off starting with a bottom level position like friendly's and working her way up as she goes through life like many people do. So next time you watch another college video about slackers, maybe just enjoy it and realize that just because some people in college (even the best colleges) don't care about education, doesnt mean that it's a bad school.

Craig Brandon

Dear Wouldn't You,

OK, we agree on the 40 percent who are wasting their time and money going to a college where they don't want to learn anything. But I think that another 50 percent of students are also getting a bad deal. I suspect that these are the students who actually graduate and get a diploma, even if it takes them six years to do it.

The problem with these students is that colleges have reduced the amount of rigor and amount of minimal knowledge that is required to get a degree. As colleges have focused on "retention" rather than "education" the "student-friendly" environment has created standards so low that nearly everyone can pass.

Have you seen the surveys of college seniors that show how few of them are functionally literate, know what year the Civil War took place in and can balance a checkbook? Colleges encourage this dumbing down process by making it easier to drop classes instead of failing them, award inflated grades and forgive students who can't be bothered reading textbooks or completing assignments.

These students are awarded degrees, but certainly no one thinks they have been educated to college standards or even high school standards. Degrees are awarded for enduring the process, not for actually learning anything. They were "retained" only because flunking anyone is considered bad form, no matter how low they score on the tests.

In my expereince only 10 percent of party school students really met the criteria for receiving a degree. Yet these top of the line students receive exactly the same diploma as the students who do as little as possible. Often they even get the same grades. It's a completely unfair system that actually encourages students to do as little as possible.

Tom Mudlo

I am one of the K.S.C. flunk outs of the seventies. I stayed there for a couple of years, spending my parents money, basically for partying. It was not a total waste of time, but awake up call for life. My friends who did graduate, have done very good as a whole. Craig, in general you are correct with your assessment. I think parents would be more open to accept your ideas. While many students or younger people would not be. Bottom line, I wish I did attend all my classes and studied really hard. The problem was, I had no goals, immature and did not have a clue why I was even going to Keene!

Success At Keene

I think the best part is they failed out. Looks like you don't get A's when you don't go to class. Looks like I was safe in my decision to go to class, just in case. While some parts of the song were accurate, that song is a misrepresentation of Keene State. I've been at Keene for a few years, finishing up a double major. Sure, I partied. Go to any school on a Saturday night. You'd be retarded if that wasn't obvious. But Monday - Friday, I did my work. Sure there is a small group who may not have classes on a day in the week so they decide to party on a Tuesday. It doesn't represent a school of 6,000 people. Anyone who thinks that shouldn't be writing books, they should be reading them, like you. Whoever wrote this blog is just as stupid and immature as the two who wrote that awful song.

KSC '13

I personally believe you are just trying to sell your dumb books .. you have no idea what it is like at Keene State now. Just because someone parties does not mean they do not do well in school. You are misrepresenting Keene as a college, and as a town. You should loosen up, grab a beer, and not be such a deb. Oh and light a blunt too while your at it.

Mallory

Hey Just FYI I got a full scholarship to law school ;)

I don't regret any second at KSC!

Thank you for misrepresenting me!

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